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Is SFL out of touch? - Printable Version

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Is SFL out of touch? - James33 - 07-27-2018

Are we out of touch? Seems like a lot of the posts stem from issues within the IFB movement a couple decades ago rather than much of today that it has evolved by influential leaders (mostly in the west such as California).

From the place I am sitting at, I have noticed a major shift within the Independent Baptist movement in the past 4-5 years. Here are some things I've began to noticed happening within the past 5 years.
  • Pants are gender-neutral. No one cares anymore. 
  • Movie theaters? We used to have a standard against that?
  • Hey what happened to the hymns, what is this new music?
  • Pastor doesn't preach with tie.
  • Pastor doesn't preach with a suit jacket.
  • Ladies Conferences are changing their name to something like "Girls Rock!" #feminism
  • KJV-P not KJV-O. King James Version Preferred. Oh a new Bible version? (MEV) Hmm let me take a look.
  • Hey Thom Rainer, can you speak at my conference/fellowship gathering? 
  • Colleges allowing beards now. 
  • Why is that Pastor buttoning up his top button of his dress shirt but not wearing a tie? 
  • We must get blue lights on the stage backdrop. 
  • Why do every graphic social media post look like its from Hillsong or Southern Baptist Theological Seminary?
  • We don't call them Brother so and so anymore?
Here are some of the things that didn't go away but changed.. either better or worse.
  • Man worship. Different from Hyle's era though. It's more a trending style now. This issue has evolved because of social media such as Facebook and Twitter.
  • No accountability: Jack Trieber at GSBC with recent scandal, Jeremy Whitman case. Mike Zachary.
It's late so I'm still adding to this list, bear with me.


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - Natalie - 07-27-2018

I thinks it’s regional. Where I live, it is changing, but it’s still all very much the same. I live smack dab in the belt buckle of the Bible Belt, so it will take a while to change here.

The pastor worship bothers me the most, and unfortunately, the franchise churches seem to be picking up the trend.


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - Darrell - 07-27-2018

It depends on which "camp" you are in.

There's a Fundy church 5 minutes from my house that still exhibits all the classic behaviors noted here.

But you'll notice that in my last post I call out the fact that I've since moved on and am no longer current on the latest Fundy tends. Things could be changing... I neither know nor really have any reason to care.


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - RobMille - 07-27-2018

To quote Eulalie Mackecknie Shinn, I'm reticent (to believe they changed).


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - WalrusWrangler - 07-27-2018

My old church is still very much the same. They didn't have rules about women wearing pants or movie theaters, but they do still think that skirts are for church and that you shouldn't watch anything with language. KJVO is as strong as ever, if not stronger. The other things are still pretty strong as well. Like Darrel, though, I don't keep up with things outside my old churches, where I still have friends. So I don't know much about what the big groups are doing.


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - rtgmath - 07-27-2018

Fundies change? Only the externals.

Granted, they had hung onto the externals with a death grip, until society had moved so far away from them they had nothing left to hold onto and precious little to complain about (or else they'd be complaining about everyone in the church, and you can't have that!).

Don't worry, though. They will rustle up some more externals to hang onto. There are these periodic shifts.

Why there have been such shifts before. I remember going through some old papers of a deceased fundy preacher and seeing a little pamphlet on the evils of paperback books. No kidding! I wish I'd obtained it. It was a rant against the popular dime novels of the day, the adventure stories. And it was published as a pamphlet. I doubt the author saw the irony.

But internally? They haven't changed. They just have to find other things to be hateful and arrogant about.


Is SFL out of touch? - EnlightenedMK - 07-27-2018

I think it depends where you are and which church you look at. In my town (also buckle of the Bible Belt, hi Natalie) the church I grew up in is still über stark fundamentalist, although the men are now wearing beards and bow ties. The fundy-light church that we were with for a while is swinging back towards strong fundamentalism, due to an influx of fundamentalist congregants from churches that have either closed or gotten “too liberal”, the biggest changes are in the youth department where they are shifting to very fundy rules, instead of trying to change from the top down they’re influencing the youth and trying to let them influence the rest as they grow up. We also have several independent or southern Baptist Churches that are more along the lines of what you described. My brother in another state his church is heavily influenced by fundamentalism and unfortunately they are growing. I think as a whole the fundamentalism is the same as it’s always been. There are a few church that used to be fundamentalist and are becoming more liberal, but they aren’t fundamentalist anymore, not by their own definition and they are no longer accepted by the fundamentalist communities. I have family members in each of these other churches so I’m still very up on what is going on in them.


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RE: Is SFL out of touch? - Ricardo - 07-27-2018

The churches in Costa Rica where my friends go seem to have become much more charismatic and/or joined the Gospel of Prosperity bandwagon. There seems to be an abundance of Prophets and Apostles. Cult of personality seems to be rampant.

And yet, -or maybe because of it- churches seem to be thriving.

The current pastor -and his pastor wife- of the church where I grew up, disbanded the board of elders and of deacons, fired the treasurer, run the church by fiat. He sold the historic building in the middle of town. Moved to the suburbs, with ample parking.

The membership doubled just about immediately!


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - Ricardo - 07-27-2018

SFL has ALWAYS been out of touch!

The vast majority of us came because we were looking for a place to think out loud the discrepancies between what was said and what was done in our churches. Or between what we read in Scripture and what was being preached in our churches.

Then there were those of us who joined looking for First Aid after some abuse perpetrated by the specific church we came from or from well-meaning or not so well-meaning relatives.

SFL was -and continues to be- an oasis for convalescing Christians.


RE: Is SFL out of touch? - WalrusWrangler - 07-27-2018

I was thinking about it earlier this week. It feels good to be out of touch. I've been out of the fold for just over four years now, and although it will never be eradicated, the fundy influence on me is considerably more faded than I ever expected it to be. It makes the distress from when I first considered leaving so worth it. Now that my parents have left my old church, I barely even have ties to that old life now.